Insuring a car with a rollcage - any experience?

[m-racer]

I am thinking about buying an E30 M3 (2.5, Evo clone, modified) which has the rear seat removed and a permanent cage installed with 4 point belts. It is a beautiful example and would get both street and driving school /autox time. I am not sure how to best insure it. I know Hagerty wont touch it and my last E30 M3 was insured with them. I have had a dedicated track car that was trailered before, but never a street car set up like this. Any advice?

[Bimmerguy2002]

i dont know anything about insurance but will they not insure a car with a cage because its a "potential safety issue" of some sort?

[Tammer in Philly]

I am thinking about buying an E30 M3 (2.5, Evo clone, modified) which has the rear seat removed and a permanent cage installed with 4 point belts. It is a beautiful example and would get both street and driving school /autox time. I am not sure how to best insure it. I know Hagerty wont touch it and my last E30 M3 was insured with them. I have had a dedicated track car that was trailered before, but never a street car set up like this. Any advice?

While it certainly won't be as cheap as a good Hagerty policy, your best bet may be to get an agreed-value policy with your primary carrier (whoever covers your E38--do you still have that?--and your wife's E53) as a "limited-use" vehicle. It should be pretty reasonable cost-wise. They may impose an 8500 mile/year limit and a restriction on commuting, but it should ring in under $600/year. Then, supplement that with trackday insurance. There's a company that sets up a policy with a value that you state, and the annual premium is a small percentage of that value plus $XX/day on track.

For a valuable/older car that is difficult to get a fair "market value" on, that's probably the safest way to cover the dual-use aspect. The roll cage shouldn't pose an issue; it doesn't render a car illegal for street use.

Post pics if you get it!

-tammer

[m-racer]

I am thinking about buying an E30 M3 (2.5, Evo clone, modified) which has the rear seat removed and a permanent cage installed with 4 point belts. It is a beautiful example and would get both street and driving school /autox time. I am not sure how to best insure it. I know Hagerty wont touch it and my last E30 M3 was insured with them. I have had a dedicated track car that was trailered before, but never a street car set up like this. Any advice?

While it certainly won't be as cheap as a good Hagerty policy, your best bet may be to get an agreed-value policy with your primary carrier (whoever covers your E38--do you still have that?--and your wife's E53) as a "limited-use" vehicle. It should be pretty reasonable cost-wise. They may impose an 8500 mile/year limit and a restriction on commuting, but it should ring in under $600/year. Then, supplement that with trackday insurance. There's a company that sets up a policy with a value that you state, and the annual premium is a small percentage of that value plus $XX/day on track.

For a valuable/older car that is difficult to get a fair "market value" on, that's probably the safest way to cover the dual-use aspect. The roll cage shouldn't pose an issue; it doesn't render a car illegal for street use.

Post pics if you get it!

-tammer

Thanks. That is helpful. Yes, I still have the E38 (decided to keep it) and the E53's as well as the old stuff with the exception of the B9 that went to Mike Gray and the E24 I am getting ready to put up for sale. See you at VIR sometime? Tim

[w0014170]

I insured that M3 I talked about a few weeks ago and had no problem getting coverage. That car has a full cage with 5pt harnesses, if it's licensed and registered and equipped with a safety inspection sticker where required there shouldn't be a problem. Some companys will use the mod to attempt a "rate up", but if you push the issue, you'll get coverage w/o the crap.
After all, if the state says it's safe, and the insurance companys are regulated by the state insurance commission who do you think will win the issue?
Doug

[Tammer in Philly]

Thanks. That is helpful. Yes, I still have the E38 (decided to keep it) and the E53's as well as the old stuff with the exception of the B9 that went to Mike Gray and the E24 I am getting ready to put up for sale. See you at VIR sometime? Tim

I'll look up the trackday insurance company's name and pass it on when I get a moment (still in lab).

VIR: yes, March with Tarheel or June with NCC.

-tammer

[Mike W.]

After all, if the state says it's safe, and the insurance companys are regulated by the state insurance commission who do you think will win the issue?

Maybe I'm just cynical, but I'd put good money on the insurance companies. Whose campaign contributions do you think are more remembered, yours or the insurance industry?

[C.R. Krieger]

After all, if the state says it's safe, and the insurance companys are regulated by the state insurance commission who do you think will win the issue?

Maybe I'm just cynical, but I'd put good money on the insurance companies. Whose campaign contributions do you think are more remembered, yours or the insurance industry?

Ah; that's why there's an insurance commission in virtually every state. It offers some parity to the consumer, depending upon how much power the legislature has given it. Most are pretty autonomous and they will not hesitate to smack down an errant provider.

As for the roll cage, why would you even mention it? The questions about "modifications" are related more to items the insurer would have to pay for if damaged or stolen. It is not likely that either one would happen to your cage. I would simply not disclose it based on that theory. If it gets bent or stolen, I would not ask the company to repair or replace it.

A close analogy would be a bike rack on your roof. If you have it listed as an accessory and pay premiums to insure it, they would have to replace it if stolen. OTOH, if you didn't mention it and it was stolen, what do you think your insurer would say about a claim?

[m-racer]

After all, if the state says it's safe, and the insurance companys are regulated by the state insurance commission who do you think will win the issue?

Maybe I'm just cynical, but I'd put good money on the insurance companies. Whose campaign contributions do you think are more remembered, yours or the insurance industry?

Ah; that's why there's an insurance commission in virtually every state. It offers some parity to the consumer, depending upon how much power the legislature has given it. Most are pretty autonomous and they will not hesitate to smack down an errant provider.

As for the roll cage, why would you even mention it? The questions about "modifications" are related more to items the insurer would have to pay for if damaged or stolen. It is not likely that either one would happen to your cage. I would simply not disclose it based on that theory. If it gets bent or stolen, I would not ask the company to repair or replace it.

A close analogy would be a bike rack on your roof. If you have it listed as an accessory and pay premiums to insure it, they would have to replace it if stolen. OTOH, if you didn't mention it and it was stolen, what do you think your insurer would say about a claim?

Thanks for your thoughts. In Florida (unlike any other state I have ever lived in) the insurance carrier (at least State Farm) physically inspects the vehicle (hard to dodge the track use question when there is a full cage in the car and no back seat). Hagerty, who insures my other old stuff, requires detailed pics and the same question will rise from those as will from the inspection.

[Bill in MN]

I have a Modified policy through JC Taylor and I think several other carriers have them as well. Anything's allowed with this policy in respect to what's been done to the car. Yearly mileage is limited but for my purposes it's not a big deal. Otherwise I'd say CR's correct, don't mention it. As long as you are not "competing" there's not much they can say/do.

[m-racer]

I have a Modified policy through JC Taylor and I think several other carriers have them as well. Anything's allowed with this policy in respect to what's been done to the car. Yearly mileage is limited but for my purposes it's not a big deal. Otherwise I'd say CR's correct, don't mention it. As long as you are not "competing" there's not much they can say/do.

Per my previous post, there is no way of "not mentioning it" in my case and I do plan on tracking the car.

[w0014170]

After all, if the state says it's safe, and the insurance companys are regulated by the state insurance commission who do you think will win the issue?

Maybe I'm just cynical, but I'd put good money on the insurance companies. Whose campaign contributions do you think are more remembered, yours or the insurance industry?

I suppose that a "plus" resulting from Katrina is the scrutiny of all the insurers doing business in the state. There tends to be a rather large amount of leeway in coverages provided it does not concern "storm surge"
Doug

[Ted in T.O.]

You sold the B9! What will you be bringing to V@V?

[m-racer]

You sold the B9! What will you be bringing to V@V?

Euro M5, 635CSi or 2002.