Front indicators not working

[ComputerKid]

Just as the title says. I've looked around and couldn't really find anything concrete. So first the symptoms are absolutely no turn signals on the front indicators, rears work fine but at double speed. Hazards function as normal, so do low and high beams. Also as best as I could tell all bulbs in the taillights worked, reverse lights, brake, etc.

So now for what I have tested. As far as I can tell the bulbs are a dual filament, one for the indicator, and one for the running lights? As best I can tell they both work, the running lights and high beam switch on/ off with no problem. I tested the indicator filament by rotating the plug 90 degrees as shown below, connecting the wire meant for the running lights to the indicator prong, then just getting a wire to ground the prong on the headlight that is normally connected to the brown wire, and bingo bang bongo the light works (obviously steady no flashing) so I'm 99.9% sure the bulbs in the headlights are not the problem. I then checked all the bulbs in the rear lights and to the best of my knowledge they are functioning fine. I then "tested" the indicator relay under the steering column. It could hear it clicking when the indicator was on, I also got a random piece of trailer wiring, touched it to one of the prongs on the relay, while it was still plugged into the harness, and then touched it to one of the prongs of the headlights and then all four headlights on the front of the car started flashing ( this didn't really tell me much ). I still don't really know if the relay is working properly as I'm not sure how to test it, if someone could give me a link to a video/ article that would be great. As well as this I checked the voltage going to both indicators when the appropriate indicator was on and I would assume it to alternate between 0 and 12V a few times a second but it read a steady 0~0.1 V.

So as a conclusion I think that a wire is either pinched somewhere in the front end of the car between the headlights and relay in the steering column possibly causing it to ground out, or I think the relay isn't working. A couple things to note I took the front US bumper off the car as well as the side indicators, etc which is a total of 4 bulbs, this could hardly be the problem? And as well as that I also MAY have shorted something in the fuse box when working on the car while it was parked for the winter although I doubt this to be the case as the car still starts and runs and this indicator is the only wiring issue I'm aware of.

[demetk]

All 3 prongs on the bulb housing still intact or is one broken off?

[RonW]

...the symptoms are absolutely no turn signals on the front indicators, rears work fine but at double speed. Hazards function as normal, so do low and high beams. Also as best as I could tell all bulbs in the taillights worked, reverse lights, brake, etc.

Got it - front turn signals don't work. Are you sure the front hazards work? The hazards will blink at the right speed even if the front bulbs aren't working because the flasher uses the load from the bulbs to time the blinking. Since both rear bulbs are in the circuit when the hazards are on, you'll have sufficient load to make them blink at the right rate even if the front bulbs are missing, electrically speaking.

As far as I can tell the bulbs are a dual filament, one for the indicator, and one for the running lights?

That is correct.

As best I can tell they both work, the running lights and high beam switch on/ off with no problem. I tested the indicator filament by rotating the plug 90 degrees as shown below, connecting the wire meant for the running lights to the indicator prong, then just getting a wire to ground the prong on the headlight that is normally connected to the brown wire, and bingo bang bongo the light works (obviously steady no flashing) so I'm 99.9% sure the bulbs in the headlights are not the problem.

Whahhh? I have no idea what you're doing here.

1. You just said low and high beams work correctly, so why are you messing with the headlights?
2. You say you're testing the indicator filament by rotating the plug 90°, but that's the headlight plug in the picture, and I see no additional grounding wire such as you mentioned.
3. "bingo bang bongo the light works." Which light? If all you did was what I see in the picture, the front running lights should still work. Is that what you're seeing?

I then checked all the bulbs in the rear lights and to the best of my knowledge they are functioning fine. I then "tested" the indicator relay under the steering column. It could hear it clicking when the indicator was on, I also got a random piece of trailer wiring, touched it to one of the prongs on the relay, while it was still plugged into the harness, and then touched it to one of the prongs of the headlights and then all four headlights on the front of the car started flashing ( this didn't really tell me much ).

That sounds bad for the flasher unit. The headlights draw significantly more current than the turn signal lights, and the flasher wasn't designed to handle that much current.

I still don't really know if the relay is working properly as I'm not sure how to test it, if someone could give me a link to a video/ article that would be great.

The hazards work at the right speed, and the turn signals work at double speed because the front hazard lights are out. That tells me the relay is working correctly.

As well as this I checked the voltage going to both indicators when the appropriate indicator was on and I would assume it to alternate between 0 and 12V a few times a second but it read a steady 0~0.1 V.

So as a conclusion I think that a wire is either pinched somewhere in the front end of the car between the headlights and relay in the steering column possibly causing it to ground out,

That would blow Fuse 11.

or I think the relay isn't working. A couple things to note I took the front US bumper off the car as well as the side indicators, etc which is a total of 4 bulbs, this could hardly be the problem? And as well as that I also MAY have shorted something in the fuse box when working on the car while it was parked for the winter although I doubt this to be the case as the car still starts and runs and this indicator is the only wiring issue I'm aware of.

I had a similar problem with the front turn signals years ago. It turned out the springy contact for the turn signal had lost its springiness, so it wouldn't always contact the bulb. I bent it back and all was well.

[ComputerKid]

Thanks for the reply. I did actually double check. I made a mistake, the hazards blink at the correct speed on the cluster but the front headlights do not flash. As for the picture a ground wire was present when I tested it, but since it was just a loose wire it was hard for me to hold it/ show it while also taking the photo. Also demetk the light still has all three prongs, none are broken off. So from what you said if the relay is working its either a fuse I blew or a wire of in between the relay and headlights that is grounded out?

[RonW]

Thanks for the reply. I did actually double check. I made a mistake, the hazards blink at the correct speed on the cluster but the front headlights do not flash.?

So when you say, "the front headlights do not flash" do you mean the headlights don't turn on? That the high beams don't work? That the flash function (high beams when you pull the turn stalk toward you) doesn't work?

[ComputerKid]

Thanks for the reply. I did actually double check. I made a mistake, the hazards blink at the correct speed on the cluster but the front headlights do not flash.?

So when you say, "the front headlights do not flash" do you mean the headlights don't turn on? That the high beams don't work? That the flash function (high beams when you pull the turn stalk toward you) doesn't work?

It means that when I push the hazard button inside the car the rear taillights both flash in unison at the correct speed, the lights in the cluster flash together at the correct speed, and the headlights do nothing. The low beams and high beams function properly as I mentioned previously, i.e they work the same as when the car was delivered from the factory. I cannot remember checking the indicators with either the low or high beams on. Also I did not test the flash function either( pulling the indicator stalk towards me ).

[RonW]

Ok, so...

What do we know?

• Everything works normally except that the front blinkers don't blink.
• And they don't blink even when you use your 4-way flashers.
• The turn signals run at about double speed, but the 4-way flashers work at normal speed.
• But both filaments of each turn signal/flasher bulb are good.

Are we all agreed on that much?

[ComputerKid]

Ok, so...

What do we know?

• Everything works normally except that the front blinkers don't blink.
• And they don't blink even when you use your 4-way flashers.
• The turn signals run at about double speed, but the 4-way flashers work at normal speed.
• But both filaments of each turn signal/flasher bulb are good.

Are we all agreed on that much?

Yes everything above is correct.

[RonW]

Ok, so...

What do we know?

• Everything works normally except that the front blinkers don't blink.
• And they don't blink even when you use your 4-way flashers.
• The turn signals run at about double speed, but the 4-way flashers work at normal speed.
• But both filaments of each turn signal/flasher bulb are good.

Are we all agreed on that much?

Yes everything above is correct.

In that case my best guess is the turn signal contact in the bulb front sockets not physically contacting the bulbs. As I mentioned before, it happened to me.

[ComputerKid]

Hello everyone,

I still haven't solved the problem. This is my progress so far. Here are two photos from the e28 528e electrical trouble shooting manual. I edited one of the photos to show whats working. As far as I can tell both flasher and indicator relay have to be working if the instrument cluster/ rear indicators work because it all goes through nodes s218 and s219. Which means I am having a problem between s218/s219 and the ground g102. So that only leaves both bulbs not working, the connector c102 for both wires not working, or the wire somewhere along that path being grounded? I'll double check this weekend that the bulbs are working and they're grounding correctly. Any help/ pointers would be greatly appreciated.