Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Input

E28 technical advice asked and given! Troubleshooting, modifications and more.
Tinkwithanr
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Joined: Feb 04, 2014
Location: Ohio

Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Input

Post by Tinkwithanr »

E28 (and possibly others) Digital Gauges
by Tinker Engineering

As great as BMW's engines are, one thing that's always bothered me is how little information they give you about the vital statistics. All you get is a generic coolant temp gauge which leaves a lot to be desired. Sure you can add aftermarket 52mm gauges, but they're either an eyesore on top of your dash or completely out of your normal range of vision causing you to take your eyes off the road to glance down. So I decided to come up with something that was very functional, very informative, and last but not least didn't ruin the clean factory look of our cars. This is what I have come up with so far (sorry for the potato phone pic):

Image

Now that I have a prototype working reliably, I wanted to start this thread to gauge interest and get the input of the community as to what features/information/capabilities you would like to see from the unit. I'll break down the basic components that are being used, as well as a few different configurations that I think would make sense to make available for purchase.

First off, the basic design of the unit consists of the Sensors, the Control Board and the Screen.

Sensors - The Sensors are the beginning of the system. Because most of BMW's engines didn't come with any sensors aside from coolant temp, we have to add new ones in order to get the valuable information we want. The setup I'm running right now utilizes a standard Thermistor type sending unit for the Coolant and Oil Temperature readings. For Oil Pressure I have a transducer that receives power from the Control Board and feeds a clean signal back as an input. The AFR is currently handled with an Innovate 02 Sensor/Reader combo, which also gives me a signal to read with the Control Board.

Control Board - The Control Board is the brains of the operations. All of the raw data from the sensors gets sent into the board. After some analog signal processing the data is read by an off the shelf microprocessor. This holds the program, as well as the logic for calculating the different variables depending on settings selected by the user. At the moment I have (3) 2 position switches for user input. This could be expanded if the need arises for more flexibility in the program itself. Once the microprocessor has computed the sensor data into usable information, it translates it into code that is send out to the Screen.

Screen - The Screen displays our helpful engine vitals in an easy to read format right there in the center of your gauge cluster. After some trial and error I was able to find a screen that 'fits' in the stock location for the water temp gauge. As you can see from the crude picture above, I currently have 4 different readouts showing on the screen. The color of the screen is also calibrated to match the stock amber coloring of the other lcd's in the car, as well as the stock gauge cluster backlights.


Important Things to Know:

1) As you might have already guessed, installing this in the gauge cluster does require modification to your stock cluster. I currently took my spare and literally cut off the coolant temperature gauge. This did not affect the operation of any of the other gauges, nor did it mean touching any of the circuit boards. I'll post a picture of what is required. With the stock coolant temp gauge out of the way, I was able to fit the screen in it's place.

2) Again, this was probably obvious, but depending on the level of integration you want with your vehicle you will need to splice into your stock wiring harness. I have a few ideas that would be very slick to integrate, but can't be done without some splicing. I would love to source a male/female connector that could be plugged inline to pull the needed power and signals from the car, but I have not been able to do so yet.


Current Specs

Right now I have (5) readings that can be shown on the display:
-Coolant Temp
-Oil Temp
-Oil Pressure
-Air/Fuel Ratio
-Volts

My initial though is to use one of the 2-position switches on the Control Board case to let the user select between Air/Fuel ratio and Volts. This is because the A/F setup is somewhat pricey to add. This would give you the option of buying the simplified system first while having the ability to add an AFR input down the road.

Another of the 2-position switches will allow the user to change between Imperial Units (degrees F, PSI) to Metric Units (degrees C, BAR). I feel like keeping the system more universal as opposed to Unit specific will make producing them easier, as well as give the end user more options. If you're feeling extra Euro that morning you can flip a switch and read BAR all day. There's no need for different sending units or transducers for the different units, the conversions are all handled within the software.


Future Additions

These are a few of the things that are not currently implemented but that I'm working on or plan to start soon.

- Dimming/Brightness control - Ties into your stock dimmer circuit to match the intensity of the dash lights during night driving.
- Warning LED's/Buzzer - Because the microprocessor is always reading the sensor values, it knows when something is too high or low. I've already tested the code and it work beautifully, I just need to finish installing the actual LED and Buzzer that will activate when a parameter is out of range. One thought is to use the stock Oil pressure light, or just add another one somewhere in the gauge cluster.
- Other vitals to monitor - I would like to add a Boost sensor/display option, though it would be difficult to choose what settings to replace. One thought is to give the screen a cycling display so that it reads certain parameters for a few seconds, then moves to new ones, then back and so forth.
- Headlight On Dummy Buzzer - Maybe it's just me, but I'm super forgetful about leaving my headlight switch in the on position as I get out of the car. I haven't drained the battery yet, but it's probably only a matter of time. I would like to take an input from the light switch that activates the buzzer, as well as prints a readout to the screen politely reminding the driver to the lights off if it detects the switch in the 'ON' position once the ignition is turned off.
- Expanding to Other Platforms - The Screen fits great inside the e28 gauge cluster, and would probably work in most e24's due to the similarity (I haven't been able to test this yet). That being said it would also be possible to mount the Screen inside a small enclosure, which would enable the system to be installed in just about any vehicle you can think of. While it wouldn't be the stealth install we get in the e28, it could still be done very cleanly and discretely. This is probably of less interest to the E28 community, but I thought I would put it out there anyway.

Moving Forward

1) First and foremost, I'd like to hear your thoughts and input. The main goal is to make something that is useful for as many people as possible.
2) Once I get the design a bit more finalized and neat, I would like to make a few units to send out as a beta test. It's one thing to have a unit working great in my car, but I would really like the real world feedback from a few other people. I would put the 'kits' together at a discount, and take requests once I have them ready to go out (no need to PM me about it right now lol). Also, anyone that does the beta tests will get free upgrades as the design progresses, so you wouldn't be stuck with an inferior unit once testing is done.
3) Once the circuitry is finalized and I'm content with the reliability I will get a batch of boards made up for a full public release. As I said before I see at least 2 levels for the system, one with AFR and one without. There may be more options depending on demand and feasibility.

With that I look forward to hearing from you guys.
Thanks!

P.S. - Feel free to check out Tinker Engineering on Facebook or on Instagram @TinkerEngineering if you want the absolute latest updates.
mitch5
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Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by mitch5 »

This is an awesome idea and I personally like it better than the other option that the guy is selling over from Europe. Now what would make this gauge fantastic is if you could add a serial port so that the user could enter the. Sender values for the input. Example would be like the resistance for the temp sender or the voltage for the different wideband manufactured. This would allow the gauge to be universal and would greatly expand the market. To my knowledge there is no such gauge like that for non obd2 car.
RC000E
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Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by RC000E »

My suggestion, having developed many, many parts for the aftermarket since 1998...keep the first version simple. It's enough to give people a setup that works, has 4 position values and that's it....no buzzers, control switches, etc. Monetize your time thus far, and simply get it to a refined ENOUGH state...even put a few kits out that have to be worked into place...recover...that's the point. Getting some people with them installed, will generate further interest also. Once you recover some of your time and financial investment, then consider a vers. 2 that adds features you want to add.
Kyle in NO
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Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by Kyle in NO »

This is a very slick setup. I would like to see dimming capability most importantly. I drive mine more often than not at night, and a bright display will give me a headache. Independantly dimmable from the rest of the cluster would be great.
tig
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Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by tig »

I'm in. I'll buy two today.

Things I'd like:

- use the momentary OBC switch in the left steering wheel stalk to cycle through modes.
- I like the idea of the display replacing the PRNDL lights, but beggars can't be choosers (actuall a 4x3 LCD replacing the whole center piece would be killer...someone else has posted they are working on this)
I already have an innovate AFM setup, so that's cool.

Keep us posted.
Tinkwithanr
Posts: 108
Joined: Feb 04, 2014
Location: Ohio

Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by Tinkwithanr »

mitch5 wrote:This is an awesome idea and I personally like it better than the other option that the guy is selling over from Europe. Now what would make this gauge fantastic is if you could add a serial port so that the user could enter the. Sender values for the input. Example would be like the resistance for the temp sender or the voltage for the different wideband manufactured. This would allow the gauge to be universal and would greatly expand the market. To my knowledge there is no such gauge like that for non obd2 car.
Hm, that is an interesting idea. Though to be honest it's a bit further than I want to go from a programming standpoint. I'd also be concerned of the accuracy people would get from using different senders. The temperature sender for example is more or less and inverse exponential curve, and there is quite a lot of math that goes into getting the right reading from the range of resistances it would have. By standardizing the sending units I can spend the time to test and check the calculated values compared to the readings and ensure the most accurate gauges possible.

RC000E wrote:My suggestion, having developed many, many parts for the aftermarket since 1998...keep the first version simple. It's enough to give people a setup that works, has 4 position values and that's it....no buzzers, control switches, etc. Monetize your time thus far, and simply get it to a refined ENOUGH state...even put a few kits out that have to be worked into place...recover...that's the point. Getting some people with them installed, will generate further interest also. Once you recover some of your time and financial investment, then consider a vers. 2 that adds features you want to add.
Thanks for the input, I can definitely see where you're coming from. I will probably take your advise and release a version based on how it's working now, but in a more production/install friendly package (it's somewhat cobbled together atm for testing purposes).

Kyle in NO wrote:This is a very slick setup. I would like to see dimming capability most importantly. I drive mine more often than not at night, and a bright display will give me a headache. Independantly dimmable from the rest of the cluster would be great.
Independent dimming is a great idea. I could place a knob on the control box that would let you decide how bright/dim you want the display. That would also mean you don't need to tie into the stock dimmer circuit, which is always a plus in my book.

cek wrote:I'm in. I'll buy two today.

Things I'd like:

- use the momentary OBC switch in the left steering wheel stalk to cycle through modes.
- I like the idea of the display replacing the PRNDL lights, but beggars can't be choosers (actuall a 4x3 LCD replacing the whole center piece would be killer...someone else has posted they are working on this)
I already have an innovate AFM setup, so that's cool.

Keep us posted.
In order:
- That actually exactly what I was thinking. You'd also be cycling through the OBC, but you could either disconnect that if you didn't want it to control that anymore or just live with it doing both.
- I would love to find an LCD that fits in the PRNDL area and give the resolution/output needed, but I haven't found anything that fits the bill yet. I am always keeping an eye out though. (And the guy with the 4x3 LCD was me also, that's a bit down the road once this setup is truly up and running. The level of controller and programming required will be a few notches above where this system is currently.)
tig
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Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by tig »

Is the controller you are using powerful enough for an IP/http stack? The ability to tinker via WiFi would be da bomb.
Tinkwithanr
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Location: Ohio

Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by Tinkwithanr »

Not really, or at least not that I'm aware of. I can't say that I'm terribly versed in IP/HTTP programming, so maybe it's easier to do than I think. That being I'm fairly certain the controller would need to be upgraded, it has very limited ram and flash storage which isn't really conducive to a user interface fancier than a few buttons.
tig
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Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by tig »

What other io does it have? Tell me what it is and I can look it up.
Tinkwithanr
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Location: Ohio

Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by Tinkwithanr »

Hey Cek, tried to send you a message but it wouldn't go thru.
cibie
Posts: 57
Joined: Dec 24, 2007
Location: Sacramento

Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by cibie »

Warning LED's/Buzzer...
If possible, I would consider having the color change to red when things are out of range.
Tinkwithanr
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Location: Ohio

Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by Tinkwithanr »

cibie wrote:If possible, I would consider having the color change to red when things are out of range.
Depending on the final specs on the screen that is an option. I had that on one of my original versions, but had to change from that screen interface due to reliability issues. I'd like to try it again with a new design that should solve the problems I was having. If it works out that would definitely be possible.
tig
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Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by tig »

Tinkwithanr wrote:Hey Cek, tried to send you a message but it wouldn't go thru.
Email: charlie AT kindel.com
528elover
Posts: 657
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Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by 528elover »

i've been waiting for someone to do this for a long time! I'm in!
travisj
Posts: 1153
Joined: Nov 05, 2009
Location: Arvada, CO

Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by travisj »

528elover wrote:i've been waiting for someone to do this for a long time! I'm in!
+1

And I like the location replacing the temp gauge.
delvin
Posts: 263
Joined: Jan 05, 2013
Location: Ft. Worth, Texas

Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by delvin »

Take my money already.

I don't like my gauges down by the shifter now and I'm a not digging the idea of installing the gauge pod I have onto a near perfect dash. Not just the holes i would be drilling it's also nefarious individuals being alerted by the gauge pod.
Hffvdbl
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Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by Hffvdbl »

I'm in the same boat Delvin
Tinkwithanr
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Location: Ohio

Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by Tinkwithanr »

Thanks guys.

Quick update:
My order for the new screen controller came in today, so I'm hoping to get that wired back up in the next day or two. This will let me test out the dimming function as well as flashing red during warnings. It also will reduce the number of wires going to the screen from 4 to 3. This weekend I'm also going to work on the screen mount itself. The plan is to 3D print a plastic bracket that interfaces with the top of the service indicator light board (where the coolant temp sensor used to be). I'll document the process so you can have a good idea of what will be required for mounting.

After I'm confident in the new screen controller I will finalize the design of the main circuit board and send out a batch based on the number of interested parties. I'm hoping to have the initial group buy start in the next two weeks. There will be a discount for those in the first group buy. After that they will be available at 'retail'.
chevale
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Location: Toronto, Canada

Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by chevale »

Interested. Please count me in when it's ready,
delvin
Posts: 263
Joined: Jan 05, 2013
Location: Ft. Worth, Texas

Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by delvin »

Great news on the progress. Count me in on that first buy as well. I would also like to volunteer myself as a beta tester if you need one :laugh:
Mike in Seattle
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Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by Mike in Seattle »

I would also interested in these!
mxlntnr
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Location: Portland OR

Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by mxlntnr »

Count me in as well! I would love to have one of these in my E28! It looks great!

I think it would be nice to have the screen dim with the dash lights and not just independently because otherwise you'll have to adjust the brightness separately every time you drive at night. It would, however, be ideal to have them adjust with the dash and have an independent control as well to really dial in the brightness to a non-irritating level. Every aftermarket stereo I've had has been much to bright at night and i always ended up taking the face plate off part way on long night drives.

The idea of using the OBC switch on the LH steering wheel stock is a good one. I'd much rather have it control your display than the OBC.

I would also be interested in a larger display that replaces the whole center section of the instrument cluster.

All in all though, I would be more than happy with what you've designed at this point! It would be very nice to have the addition information while driving. Very cool!
cibie
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Location: Sacramento

Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by cibie »

Also interested, please count me in on the first batch.
travisj
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Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by travisj »

If my previous response wasn't enough, count me in!
mescko
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Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by mescko »

PM sent.
funfunfer
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Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by funfunfer »

Our very own kickstarter project!
I'm in
geordi
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Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by geordi »

I'm in. I'll commit to the first batch.
MicahO
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Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by MicahO »

I'm also in - looks great!
Mark 88/M5 Houston
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Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by Mark 88/M5 Houston »

I'm interested in a first run reservation depending on price and S38 compatibility of sensors.
ElGuappo
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Re: Tinker Engineering Digital Gauges - Development and Inpu

Post by ElGuappo »

This will also work on my E23, though I kind of like the gauges in the radio spot.
I'm interested depending on pricing.
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