mark
External links now open in a new browser tab - turn this off in your UCP - Read more here.
big power m30
big power m30
so, i feel as though i have enough accomplished on my build that i can start a thread. i will get into details later... for now, i'll just share some pics. hope you enjoy.
mark
mark
thank you everyone. this is a very long term and extreme project. hp goal is 1000whp. i work at a performance shop that has an awd mustang dyno that is very conservative (i like to think very true to life) we have had some high hp stuff on it, but usually they top out at 600whp or so. i simply want to make the power as a personal goal. i realize this isn't most people's cup of tea that are on this board... but i thought i would share since it is an e28. due to the high numbers, there is high cost... so, it is taking me a long time to be able to afford the hardware.
i've worked in professional road racing and have been around pretty rare and very high quality hardware most of my career so there are certain ways that i want to do things. could i reach the power levels with other parts.... of course. but, this is how i'd like to do it.
i'll try to run down the basics that i have to this point. right now i am just focusing on the motor/ turbo system. driveline/ chassis will come later.
Turbo: Garrett GTX4202 with tial 1.30 stainless vband
turbine housing. (garrett claims it will fllow 1150 crank hp... but we have made more power than what they rate their turbos at on a regular basis.)
Wastegate: Tial v60 (it's blue)
Intercooler: Garrett core with custom tanks
Intercooler piping: 3" OD Aluminum out of the compressor to the core and 3.5" OD to the throttle body.
Intake manifold: due to the complex shape that the runners need to be, i'm looking into having them machined from billet. the plenum is still somewhat up in the air. i have a plenum from a m88 motor that i may adapt, or i may build one from scratch. it has plenty of volume, (estimated at least 12 liters or so) but everything else is custom fabricated so it seems a little strange to use a factory part. either way the throttle body will be a single 90mm unit. (i'm not going to deal with trying to seal 6 individual units)
Exhaust manifold: i would love to say that it is 321 stainless, but i had to draw the line somewhere lol. due to availability of bends that i wanted, 304 tube is a better option for this anyway. i'm using 0.65/ 16 gauge. the manifold will be a 6-2-1 setup. primaries are 1.75" and match up perfectly with the head ports. secondaries are 2.25". the final short section into the turbine housing is 2.75"
Motor: custom head with one off internals (more details on that later)
fully built block with lightened crank and higher compression. havent completely decided on comp yet, but will be between 9.5 and 10.5
Engine management: AEM series 2 just to get started... will most likely switch to something more serious later down the road.
Fuel system: 4 walbro inline high pressure 255s. (i looked into more exotic options for this, but i have installed hundreds of walbros and am very impressed with the reliability and cost)
also 6 2100cc bosch injectors. the aem can control 12 injectors, and i was going to do 12 800s, but controlling the big injectors isn't really an issue like it used to be. especially with e85 and a healthy base fuel pressure.
so, there are some details to get started, i'll try to add more pics and info down the road. thanks for checking it out.
i've worked in professional road racing and have been around pretty rare and very high quality hardware most of my career so there are certain ways that i want to do things. could i reach the power levels with other parts.... of course. but, this is how i'd like to do it.
i'll try to run down the basics that i have to this point. right now i am just focusing on the motor/ turbo system. driveline/ chassis will come later.
Turbo: Garrett GTX4202 with tial 1.30 stainless vband
turbine housing. (garrett claims it will fllow 1150 crank hp... but we have made more power than what they rate their turbos at on a regular basis.)
Wastegate: Tial v60 (it's blue)
Intercooler: Garrett core with custom tanks
Intercooler piping: 3" OD Aluminum out of the compressor to the core and 3.5" OD to the throttle body.
Intake manifold: due to the complex shape that the runners need to be, i'm looking into having them machined from billet. the plenum is still somewhat up in the air. i have a plenum from a m88 motor that i may adapt, or i may build one from scratch. it has plenty of volume, (estimated at least 12 liters or so) but everything else is custom fabricated so it seems a little strange to use a factory part. either way the throttle body will be a single 90mm unit. (i'm not going to deal with trying to seal 6 individual units)
Exhaust manifold: i would love to say that it is 321 stainless, but i had to draw the line somewhere lol. due to availability of bends that i wanted, 304 tube is a better option for this anyway. i'm using 0.65/ 16 gauge. the manifold will be a 6-2-1 setup. primaries are 1.75" and match up perfectly with the head ports. secondaries are 2.25". the final short section into the turbine housing is 2.75"
Motor: custom head with one off internals (more details on that later)
fully built block with lightened crank and higher compression. havent completely decided on comp yet, but will be between 9.5 and 10.5
Engine management: AEM series 2 just to get started... will most likely switch to something more serious later down the road.
Fuel system: 4 walbro inline high pressure 255s. (i looked into more exotic options for this, but i have installed hundreds of walbros and am very impressed with the reliability and cost)
also 6 2100cc bosch injectors. the aem can control 12 injectors, and i was going to do 12 800s, but controlling the big injectors isn't really an issue like it used to be. especially with e85 and a healthy base fuel pressure.
so, there are some details to get started, i'll try to add more pics and info down the road. thanks for checking it out.
Looks like he said he is going with E85. Great for making big power as it has an effective octane of around 110 or so I think. Only downsides are that you need special fuel lines and also is takes about 33% more fuel but with what he is running that doesn't look like an issue.
I'm really curious about your "one off internals" that you mention. Going to be fun to watch your build.
I'm really curious about your "one off internals" that you mention. Going to be fun to watch your build.
-
Jelmer538i
- Posts: 1222
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
- Location: Netherlands
- Contact:
Wow thats very nice! But 1000whp in the fragile E28 chassis, I assume you seam weld and cage it otherwise the engine compartment wil break at the firewall.
What tires are you planning on? On my brothers S38 turbo powered E28 we run 255 wide semi slicks and that can barely hold the power from second gear and up.
I think this is going to be the first 1000+ whp M30, most people take a S38 or S50/54 because of the 24v head which flows a lot better.
What tires are you planning on? On my brothers S38 turbo powered E28 we run 255 wide semi slicks and that can barely hold the power from second gear and up.
I think this is going to be the first 1000+ whp M30, most people take a S38 or S50/54 because of the 24v head which flows a lot better.
-
jodystevens
- Posts: 314
- Joined: Oct 10, 2013 2:45 PM
- Location: Canada
i understand that everyone is pessimistic. maybe i won't get it to 1000... but, i'm going to do everything i can to try. i believe it will do it. someone has to. as long as i can keep the head down, i'll run whatever fuel or boost it takes to get there. i'm paying extra attention to exhaust manifold, turbine flow to keep heat and pressures low in the combustion chambers. i havent really seen anyone running freely flowing manifolds on these motors. getting the exhaust out of the head is key. so, that should help my cause a little better than most.
i'm up in the air about rear tires... i'm stuck between 315 and 335 drag radials. i'm not a drag race guy, and don't plan on drag racing this car... just want something to make it half managable. i've talked with some bigger power v8 guys and it seems 315 should be fairly reasonable
i'm up in the air about rear tires... i'm stuck between 315 and 335 drag radials. i'm not a drag race guy, and don't plan on drag racing this car... just want something to make it half managable. i've talked with some bigger power v8 guys and it seems 315 should be fairly reasonable
the intake ports flow plenty to get enough air into the chamber to make the power im looking for. the exhaust ports are a little weak in comparison and most exhaust manifolds i have seen choke that even more. if the gasses aren't getting out of the chamber, heat and pressures rise... then you can't run decent timing or boost. it also, puts more stress on the block to head connection.
to add to my last post...
the whole comp/intake/head/exhaust/turbine/ and wastegate combo is a system that all works together. every component effects how the others work. that being said, exhaust/turbine flow absolutely affects head and intake flow. especially when dealing with forced induction and cams with decent overlap.
the whole comp/intake/head/exhaust/turbine/ and wastegate combo is a system that all works together. every component effects how the others work. that being said, exhaust/turbine flow absolutely affects head and intake flow. especially when dealing with forced induction and cams with decent overlap.
haha, get out the sawzall.sideways7 wrote:
i'm up in the air about rear tires... i'm stuck between 315 and 335 drag radials. i'm not a drag race guy, and don't plan on drag racing this car... just want something to make it half managable. i've talked with some bigger power v8 guys and it seems 315 should be fairly reasonable
-
Good & Tight
- Posts: 461
- Joined: Oct 29, 2007 11:16 AM
-
Jelmer538i
- Posts: 1222
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
- Location: Netherlands
- Contact:
One of these days I'll get around to completing a GT Power model of the M30 and I can get an idea of incremental limitations of the platform. Airflow through the head is going to be a major issue that really isn't going to have an easy and inexpensive fix.
-
Coldswede
- Posts: 6859
- Joined: Oct 10, 2008 1:48 PM
- Location: Back U.P. North,. Where the water's blue, the wind is free and seasons four.
Brad that looks to be a seriously impressive bit of software!Brad D. wrote:One of these days I'll get around to completing a GT Power model of the M30 and I can get an idea of incremental limitations of the platform. Airflow through the head is going to be a major issue that really isn't going to have an easy and inexpensive fix.
It truly is and it's so powerful it can be amazingly frustrating.t's also crazy expensive. One solver license is like $20k. We have a 16 core machine at work for lengthy simulations. Almost all manufacturers use is at the OE level for engine and after treatment modeling. I I have some crazy models generated for current production engines that we use to test different turbo matches, test the addition of EGR and anything else the client of job may need us to do. I've got a basic M30 model worked up, but haven't tried to tune the burn rates or combustion phasing yet. Once I get it finished, I could easily test out any cam configuration, head mods, timing impact and anything that might be of interest.Coldswede wrote:Brad that looks to be a seriously impressive bit of software!Brad D. wrote:One of these days I'll get around to completing a GT Power model of the M30 and I can get an idea of incremental limitations of the platform. Airflow through the head is going to be a major issue that really isn't going to have an easy and inexpensive fix.
