Control Arm (lower) bolt spining with self-locking hex nut

[harrypalmer]

Hello,

In the midst of installing E31 control arms in my '86 535i, I find myself stumbling with the bushing bolt. After a few tight solid tuns from the self-locking hex nut engaging the bolt that comes within the bushing, suddenly the bolt starts turning (rotating) endlessly in its place with the hex nut.

I know this is not correct as I R/R control arms steel units twelve years ago, but either, got lucky then, and or have forgotten by now how to make the bolt properly seat on the arm and not move as I finish tighten the self-locking hex nut to the prescribed Bentley torque spec.

Do I have to hit it with a rubber mallet from underneath to somehow have it (seat) at the base of the left tie rod lever so it wont spin?

Any ideas please on how properly bolt on the hex nut and not let it slip?   Thank you in advance.

 

[Mike W.]

Take a 16" pair of channellocks and clamp that tapered joint. You need to preload it and then you'll be able to crank it down.

I have found new tapered joints seem to come loose with few problems. Ones that have been apart before not so much. Which leads me to believe they put some lube on it on factory assembly. So I use a dab of grease, which makes it even harder to get a bite to torque that nut. But the big channellocks works, at least for me.

[harrypalmer]

Take a 16" pair of channellocks and clamp that tapered joint. You need to preload it and then you'll be able to crank it down.





 

 

 

Mike, Thank you!

Please forgive me, I expressed myself incorrectly (English as a second language here) the "bolt" that I've mentioned earlier; spinning/rotating with the self locking hex-nut, is actually the ball joint from the lower control arm.

So if I understood correctly, I grab the tapered edge of the ball joint with a 16" channellock and clamp it while I assemble the self-locking hex nut? If that is it, then the rest ought to be clear to me; preload suspension before final assembly.

Jackie

  

[Shawn D.]

So if I understood correctly, I grab the tapered edge of the ball joint with a 16" channellock and clamp it while I assemble the self-locking hex nut?

No, don't grab the taper! First, doing so would likely damage the surface. Second, if you stop and think about it, that couldn't work anyhow.

The point of using slip-joint pliers or a C-clamp is to push the tapered stud into the tapered hole forcefully enough so that friction between the stud and hole will prevent it from turning. You are not touching the stud at all, but opposite sides of the arm & knuckle.

[harrypalmer]

So if I understood correctly, I grab the tapered edge of the ball joint with a 16" channellock and clamp it while I assemble the self-locking hex nut?

No, don't grab the taper! First, doing so would likely damage the surface. Second, if you stop and think about it, that couldn't work anyhow.

The point of using slip-joint pliers or a C-clamp is to push the tapered stud into the tapered hole forcefully enough so that friction between the stud and hole will prevent it from turning. You are not touching the stud at all, but opposite sides of the arm & knuckle.



 

 

 

 

 

 

 

There used to be here a "palm on my face" emoji, that looked like Homer Simpson's head to indicate how I feel. But this will do instead Of course! It is my bad interpretation of what Mike said. So I am left with your alternative, which I will try first.
And if I don't make it work due to the "palm on my face" emoji, I'll proceed with what I actually did twelve years ago following Rod Paine's tech/rods_pages/id18.html
"Below, the left tie rod arm ball joint is attached to the center link with the ball joint cotter pin hole positioned so that the cotter pin can easily be accessed from below, since its head is at the bottom of the assembly. Tapping on the rear edge of the ball joint housing (not on the large cap) with a plastic mallet, will help seat the tapered shaft, so that it won't rotate while torquing down the shaft nut."

Thank you Shawn and Mike, and also Rod. Truly much appreciated.

[Mike W.]

Yes, ShawnD restated what I said to do, perhaps a little more clearly. But we're saying the same thing.

You mean this one? It's still there, you just have to declick the WYSIWYG Editor (This overrides the "Use Text/Source Post Editor" setting in the User Control Panel) box just below.

[harrypalmer]

Yes, ShawnD restated what I said to do, perhaps a little more clearly. But we're saying the same thing.

You mean this one? It's still there, you just have to declick the WYSIWYG Editor (This overrides the "Use Text/Source Post Editor" setting in the User Control Panel) box just below.

 

 

Just came back very briefly from the garage, just to shout a big thank you to both, you and Shawn as I was able to do what you both suggested.
I am so excited; being able to finally understand, then persevering and following through your advice to complete the task.
Will tighten bolts gingerly and remove and replace the right control arm next. Then, preload full front suspension on the ground. Thank you Mike you said it well. It is my fortune to have Shawn make me "think" and realize my misunderstanding from your instructions before I'd do the regrettable. Love the palm face as well. Thank you all.  

[Shawn D.]

You're welcome!  I'm glad you got it worked out.

[harrypalmer]

Hello to all,

Would a 5/16th of an inch (five little lines) drop or height difference, between the left and the right front shock absorbers be acceptable...

Front left side is 5/16 inch lower than the right side after installing new control arms, so I'm wondering if:

- Will the newly installed control arms be damaged by this difference? And therefore, would they need to be loosened and removed from the throughout bolt and reinstalled again to conform to a proper suspension height?

- All front suspension work performed was done with car preloaded as per Bentley. Have not driven the car since.

- Lastly, when reinstalling the sway bar links is it advisable to do so with the suspension preloaded? Thank you in advance!

[szacsi72]

I always torque them with a normal nut first, then remove, and install the self-locking one. Worked every time up to date

[gadget73]

^^ have done this.  Where it really sucks is when the tie rod or ball joint starts spinning when its partially threaded and you can't un-thread the locking nut or get a clamp or pliers around the joint to get it seated into the taper.  Using a regular nut to draw the taper fully into the seat first takes care of that quite nicely.