PSA. Car insurance, make sure the miles aren't from LSD

[Mike W.]

California, AAA insurance which may or may not be significant.

They did it once before, some time ago, but the past 3 years AAA had apparently indulged in hallucinogenic drugs to determine what they believe my mileage will be for the forthcoming year. Or perhaps just straight out insurance fraud, yeah, now that would be a shock. Without any supporting data, because there isn't any, they want to bill me for an expected 41K miles per year, for my wife and I, rather than the surprisingly consistent 20-21K per year we've had for a while. Hidden of course on the back of the declarations page, not the front with all the other info. Not a massive difference, but several hundred per year.

Last year I spoke with a supervisor and tried to get connected to the person who made that decision, and wow, that struck a nerve with her. She really didn't even want to think about connecting a customer to the fraudster, you'd have thought I was asking her to sacrifice her first born to the god of fire or something, I mean it really struck a nerve with her.

Anyway, just something to keep an eye out for. The money you save may be your own.

[kojo96]

California, AAA insurance which may or may not be significant.

They did it once before, some time ago, but the past 3 years AAA had apparently indulged in hallucinogenic drugs to determine what they believe my mileage will be for the forthcoming year. Or perhaps just straight out insurance fraud, yeah, now that would be a shock. Without any supporting data, because there isn't any, they want to bill me for an expected 41K miles per year, for my wife and I, rather than the surprisingly consistent 20-21K per year we've had for a while. Hidden of course on the back of the declarations page, not the front with all the other info. Not a massive difference, but several hundred per year.

Last year I spoke with a supervisor and tried to get connected to the person who made that decision, and wow, that struck a nerve with her. She really didn't even want to think about connecting a customer to the fraudster, you'd have thought I was asking her to sacrifice her first born to the god of fire or something, I mean it really struck a nerve with her.

Anyway, just something to keep an eye out for. The money you save may be your own.

Just a way for CSAA to hike rates recently. Our annual policy took a 35% increase this January, no rhyme or reason. No claims, tickets... We saw no increases for the longest time prior to this. We had 9 cars on the policy, I dropped 4, sold off two and non opped 2. 
I shopped around and had to peel myself off the ceiling!!! All the other main stream carriers were much higher, even with the CSAA increase. State Farm was the worst. 

[vinceg101]

Same with Collectors policies: my American Collectors Insurance (ACI) policy came up for renewal last month with a near 70% increase as well. When pressed, they said it was to cover an abundant amount of claims in California. I ended up switching over to Grundy's for the cost ACI used to be.

If you think auto policies are crazy, wait until we see our homeowner's renewals...

[stuartinmn]

Same with Collectors policies: my American Collectors Insurance (ACI) policy came up for renewal last month with a near 70% increase as well. When pressed, they said it was to cover an abundant amount of claims in California. I ended up switching over to Grundy's for the cost ACI used to be.

If you think auto policies are crazy, wait until we see our homeowner's renewals...

I haven't seen my bill from American Collectors yet this year, I'm curious if it will be affected like yours was in California.
I did get my homeowner's, it went up by 50% this year.  

[vinceg101]

Same with Collectors policies: my American Collectors Insurance (ACI) policy came up for renewal last month with a near 70% increase as well. When pressed, they said it was to cover an abundant amount of claims in California. I ended up switching over to Grundy's for the cost ACI used to be.

If you think auto policies are crazy, wait until we see our homeowner's renewals...

I haven't seen my bill from American Collectors yet this year, I'm curious if it will be affected like yours was in California.
I did get my homeowner's, it went up by 50% this year.  

It should, Kohler got his after mine and had the same increases (he's in AZ).

[Mike W.]

My point wasn't so much that rates have gone up, but that they're jacking up the "estimated" annual mileage by basically doubling it. 3 years in a row, that's insurance fraud, not a rate increase. They know what they're doing, it's not an accident. And they hide that on the back, low profile if you're not paying attention.

So after fixing that my rates only went up ~25% instead of 45%.

[vinceg101]

My point wasn't so much that rates have gone up, but that they're jacking up the "estimated" annual mileage by basically doubling it. 3 years in a row, that's insurance fraud, not a rate increase. They know what they're doing, it's not an accident. And they hide that on the back, low profile if you're not paying attention.

So after fixing that my rates only went up ~25% instead of 45%.

I get it, I'm going to have to check what they put down for us on the renewal; we usually get those mileage recording notices a few months before the renewal date but didn't this year. It was on the honor system and I learned my lesson from the 2023 renewal wherein I, honestly, reported that the E39 crossed the 10K miles/year mark. The insurance on that car automatically jumped 20%.
We didn't experience the big jump from AAA that you did for 2025.

[MLastovo]

My point wasn't so much that rates have gone up, but that they're jacking up the "estimated" annual mileage by basically doubling it. 3 years in a row, that's insurance fraud, not a rate increase. They know what they're doing, it's not an accident. And they hide that on the back, low profile if you're not paying attention.

So after fixing that my rates only went up ~25% instead of 45%.

Hey Mike and the rest y'all ,
Several years ago I too got the annoying letter requesting mileage info on the covered cars and I dismissed it. Wrong move. When my renewal arrived it was considerably more than expected so I called my agent to ask, "what up?" He was very forthcoming and stated that since I didn't provide the info the company deferred to some actuary table and used those numbers to base my rate on. I quickly filled out the form (I have no idea why it was kept on my desk for several weeks but that is another story.) and dropped it by his office. The rate came right back down. I had been with Allstate since 1990 and had never had this request but I get it, they have to have some kind of metric to work from.

Fast forward to early this year. I too got my renewal docs and was SHOCKED at the increase. I called my agent to ask, "what up?" I sat at his desk looking at the numbers on the screen of my account and he clearly stated that it was not just Allstate and it was all carriers raising, at least CA, rates and said I could check around but he was confident that one, a different carrier would not take on a new customer or two, the rate would be higher than my current Allstate policy with the same coverage. He wasn't lyin'. I paid my ~34% increased premium, if I recall correctly, and went on with life.

Fast forward to early last week. I received a flyer from USAA claiming they could save me '$725.00' on my car insurance. Now I was curious. Where did that very specific number come from? I didn't know but went to the cited Website, punched in my data and created a quote that was apples-to-apples with my Allstate policy that was to start tomorrow, the 17th. It was a saving of ~$700something and change. I was a bit perplexed as to how this happened so I printed the quote to PDF and sent it to my agent and asked, "what up?" He quickly got back to me and basically said it was a pleasure having me as a client and wished me well. That's not the entire end of the story.

On Monday I stopped by his office to give him a chance to at least come close to the USAA quote because I would rather keep my money in the community and, more importantly, I like the brick and mortar reality. If someone needs strangling, um, I mean persuading, it is much easier to do that than over the phone with some desk jockey in an unknown state of the Union. If you are lucky it's in the country... Anyway, he could not bring the rates down and he had no ill will over me leaving. He agreed that it was purely a financial decision.

The conclusion, I signed up with USAA yesterday with the policy starting tomorrow, the 17th and my agent sent me back an email confirming the refund of my payment for the upcoming coverage. While I was in his office earlier we discussed the expected upcoming property insurance rate increases that someone above alluded to. He and I kinda laughed that my, potential at that time, savings with USAA would help with the increase and we both WHOLEHEARTEDLY agreed that I, or anyone that currently has home coverage in CA, was NOT going to be going anywhere when it came to changing providers. Nope. Not happening. The cat does drive a Tesla. And it is white. (I know Vince will find that humorous.) But we're good.

r/
D.

[stuartinmn]

It is important to remember that the premium cost is only one aspect - if you are in an accident, how will they cover you.  I had some hail damage to my car summer before last, and the insurance company was pushing kind of hard that it was totaled, even before they had seen it..  I had to spend a lot of time tracking down comparable values and explaining that my M535i wasn't just some old car.  They eventually did cover the damage but it was a pain to get to that point.

[MLastovo]

It is important to remember that the premium cost is only one aspect - if you are in an accident, how will they cover you.  I had some hail damage to my car summer before last, and the insurance company was pushing kind of hard that it was totaled, even before they had seen it..  I had to spend a lot of time tracking down comparable values and explaining that my M535i wasn't just some old car.  They eventually did cover the damage but it was a pain to get to that point.

You ain't lying.
People often claim (pun intended) that they have a great agent and/or insurance. When I ask them how do they measure that, or come to that conclusion they look at me sideways. I then ask if they have ever filed a claim that the agent managed and the answer is 99% of the time, 'no.'

So, here's my spin. Insurance/agents are like concrete and your funeral. You have no idea how either will turn out until they are both finished. That is not the time to find out that you have chosen poorly. A bit of research goes a long way.

D.

[Mike W.]

It is important to remember that the premium cost is only one aspect - if you are in an accident, how will they cover you.  I had some hail damage to my car summer before last, and the insurance company was pushing kind of hard that it was totaled, even before they had seen it..  I had to spend a lot of time tracking down comparable values and explaining that my M535i wasn't just some old car.  They eventually did cover the damage but it was a pain to get to that point.

Stuart, you're absolutely correct about different companies treating customers differently. But this isn't about that, it's about the same company making up numbers with no, nada, zero, supporting evidence, doubling the projected mileage in spite of historical evidence to the contrary, and basing the premium on said made up numbers. It's fraud, simple as that.

Now, not nearly on the level of your M535i, I've had a couple or is it three, older BMWs, in good shape, that they spectacularly undervalued. Now it was the other parties insurance, but I had to fight long and hard to get even close to the real value, they just threw out a number or found a lowball comp and said it was so. These were totals in a pragmatic sense, even from an enthusiast point of view. Oddly my Dad died in a car accident. It was irrelevant to me as he was heavily in debt and I wasn't going to see anything anyway, but they valued his car at more than I felt it was worth. Not a ton, like 7K instead of 6K on a 3 year old Ford Taurus, but odd. Another oddity was Ford Motor Credit acting like this was the first time they'd had a customer die in an accident with an outstanding loan on the car. And asking me to sign a document, vaguely phrased, where I accepted the settlement. I told them I would make no claims on it, nearly equally as vague.

[BimmerDan]

Same with Collectors policies: my American Collectors Insurance (ACI) policy came up for renewal last month with a near 70% increase as well. When pressed, they said it was to cover an abundant amount of claims in California. I ended up switching over to Grundy's for the cost ACI used to be.

If you think auto policies are crazy, wait until we see our homeowner's renewals...

I haven't seen my bill from American Collectors yet this year, I'm curious if it will be affected like yours was in California.
I did get my homeowner's, it went up by 50% this year.  

Just got my ACI bill it went up $10 from last year when it doubled. They also increased my value by 12k. I shopped them against Hagerty who I used to flip to when they went up. Hagerty is now $1,430 compared to my $360. I know you CA guys are getting hammered and I’m sorry. 
my home owners went up 5k last year even after upping my deductible to $3,500.