Proposal: Locking Car FS Threads after posting.

[djazz]

Standard format: yes
Locking thread: no

I've bought and sold here. No problem at all. I've pointed out positives in ads, given compliments as free bumps to good ads, given comments to help the seller when the ad was lacking, and ridiculed ignorant, shady, and absent sellers.

I think it's a great idea to help a seller create a better ad but I want to be able to discuss the car openly with the seller and the community to reach a complete understanding of the car's value.

An honest knowledgeable seller should be fine with this. If you can't take the heat get out of the forum.

The only time I really see a problem is the very rare, truly top dollar car that attracts attention from EVERYBODY. There will always be the asshats around here to stir things up and I understand a seller in this situation not wanting to advertise here. And I'm good with that. If I want a high dollar car I'll find them.

[B7Turbo]

Who would this thread locking be designed to serve? Why is it different from a Craigslist ad which is "locked".

No different than a Craigslist ad, except targeted to the E28 community.

It serves to make the sellers experience an easier one (they now don't have to explain why they changed something on the car to a bunch of people who are not interested in the car anyway) and it will help out buyers by allowing cars which may not have been posted here (a certain Alpina and a few M5s come to mind) due to the CF in which these adds turn into.

Should we be serving the seller or the community at large?

Both parties, but those discussion can be made the same way as you are posting but inform of PM, or unlocked thread if any owners welcomes people's comments, but at least will provide a respectful environment and equal opportunity for both buyers and sellers. And this only applies to legitimate ads only.
I believe not long ago we were PMing each other in regards to an Alpina for sale discussion and ended respectfully with no problem what so ever. Was it bad?
I’m pretty sure people will warn others in many ways, if they find a seller out of line or if it’s a scam.

[oldskool]

I wouldn't. The whole thing. Accident.
Canadia.

[demetk]

I vote Lock if I was the only one empowered to do the locking and only if sellers paid for that privilege with that green stuff that has peoples pictures on it. Otherwise, I vote putting up a sign for all sellers to see stating, "Sellers beware, we bite. Advertise here at your peril.".

[ldsbeaker]

"Sellers beware, we bite. Advertise here at your peril.".

It says that, but reads: "We're worse than r3v, don't sell your shit here."

It pains me to say it, but it's the damn truth. I don't want to sell ANYTHING here. Not because I'm shady, it's just too much trouble. Plus, anything I would sell would be used crap, so it's not even worth it. Or perhaps i only buy what I need...

[demetk]

It says that, but reads: "We're worse than r3v, don't sell your shit here."

We're not that bad. For example I found Garageboy's vituperation of the M5 ad actually quite funny. I understand others, who may have more refined tastes than me, may have found it distasteful, but the point is the freedom to voice one's opinions is one of the best things about MyE28. I wouldn't have it any other way.

[Greg E34]

I have bought and sold cars and parts on this site and other Bimmer enthusiast sites. I have never had a complaint as a buyer or as a seller. Represent your wares legitimately and you have no worries. Come in with a bunch of hyperbole, bullshit and lies and face the music.

I once bought a car sight unseen from a trusted forum member here. I opted not to have it inspected. There was no bs in his fs thread because he's not a bullshitter. This site has been invaded by bullshitters wanting to sell junk or cars of questionable history or condition and they get called out. If they don't like it, they can move on to craigslist or somewhere else.

[rmiddendorf]

I have bought and sold cars and parts on this site and other Bimmer enthusiast sites. I have never had a complaint as a buyer or as a seller. Represent your wares legitimately and you have no worries. Come in with a bunch of hyperbole, bullshit and lies and face the music.

I once bought a car sight unseen from a trusted forum member here. I opted not to have it inspected. There was no bs in his fs thread because he's not a bullshitter. This site has been invaded by bullshitters wanting to sell junk or cars of questionable history or condition and they get called out. If they don't like it, they can move on to craigslist or somewhere else.

Yep.

[lilpoindexter]

Fuck locking the ad. Reading through all the comments, and wading through all the shit storms is one of the things that makes this site so much fun.
If a standardized format is used...the most important thing should be listed first.
Manual Transmission ? Yes or no.

[freetoride]

No locks, more posts = higher visibility. It's sort of a natural selection.

[mooseheadm5]

Based on responses so far, the community is open my suggestion to provide the seller with the option to lock the thread.

Except you are leaving out all the people that aren't. Like the 29 people that voted against it at the point of this post (vs 6 that agree with you.)

Bottom line is that if the post is locked, it falls down the list forever. No discussion, no bumping.

[mooseheadm5]

Both parties, but those discussion can be made the same way as you are posting but inform of PM

How can you have a conversation with the entire forum via PM?

[B7Turbo]

Both parties, but those discussion can be made the same way as you are posting but inform of PM

How can you have a conversation with the entire forum via PM?

No you can't, that is the point , carry on.

[mooseheadm5]

Both parties, but those discussion can be made the same way as you are posting but inform of PM

How can you have a conversation with the entire forum via PM?

No you can't, that is the point , carry on.

So you ask the seller for info, another person asks for info, ad nauseum. You notice something wrong, you can't tell everyone about it. You notice something good, you can't tell everyone about it. What's the point? Post it on cars.com or Craigslist.

[wkohler]

I think this is a very reactionary train of thought and very dangerous. Lately, we seem to have a rash of idiots and first time posters putting up their OMGWTFBBQ RARE!!!!1111one cars in "Collector condition." Of course, we also have some members that try to shoot down whatever they see as being not good enough. There are many people on here - I'd say more than just about any other BMW discussion forum - that know what they're looking at and cut through the bullshit. It goes both ways when it comes to selling something. A seller should have to provide the necessary information in keeping with whatever directives are provided by the hosting space or just general common sense.

Then onto one of the world's most ludicrous ideas of letting the thread be locked at the seller's discretion. You honestly think that would help us? Every seller with a car that won't pass muster will totally go for that.

All we need to do is stop bitching. This place has been really great about self-policing. There are enough people out there that will call someone out if they're unreasonable. You're seeing it in the M5 thread. Some of the conversation lately in there is just ridiculous. There are members here that

Certainly, there are threads that we should forget about in the past. I can think of a couple off the top of my head. I don't know what it was but right out of the gate, people with no business commenting on anything make some comment and a shitstorm ensues. Welcome to the Internet. We, as a community need to police ourselves. Making more rules is ridiculous. People can say, "I'm really disappointed that so and so didn't post their car for sale here" while we are looking at an ad for that car. Guess what? It's here. We're seeing it. Between everyone out there, there's hardly an advertised car that goes unnoticed.

Analyzing a car for sale is a pretty subjective thing. One man's "perfect" is something someone else would send to the yard. I've gotten several PMs this week asking for my thoughts on various cars for sale because I hadn't commented on them. I'm sure others get them as well. Point is that commentary on what's for sale or knowledgeable people asking PUBLIC QUESTIONS helps people. Take eBay for example. Let's go back to the "First M5" ebay ad. I know more than a few of us sent messages to the seller asking questions about his claims and/or pointing out that the car he was representing was anything but. None of those questions ever made it to the listing. Why? The seller has the power to determine that. That's all well and good since the seller is actually paying for a listing. That doesn't happen here. The classifieds are an added feature of this community and are done to benefit the community as a whole. If you want to charge sellers to sell parts and cars here, then lock all the ads you want. All that will happen is that general conversation will get overrun with things like, "That M5 in FL is so grody." People will reply with "Grody to the max" or "Barf out, gag me with a spoon." Then some guy will not see that thread and post another that says, "Yo, check it. Car show trophy winning M5 in FL." Then moosehead will have to go in and say, "Right, kick ass. Well, don't want to sound like a dick or nothin', but, ah... it says on your chart that you're fucked up. There's already a thread for this. Locked."

As a result, there will be no place to put the photos of Kermit jacking off to frog porn.

Yes, I know that we are all "grown-ups" (at least from an age standpoint) and should be able to make responsible decisions on our own but there are a lot of people who feel safer buying something here due to what essentially amounts to a vetting process on things that are listed here. Sometimes, people just need to hear, "Looks like a decent car. Ah, you talk like a fag, and your shit's all retarded. What I'd do, is just like... like... you know, like, you know what I mean, like..."

[Tammer in Philly]

Standard format, locked at user's discussion. But we'll just have GC posts about those cars anyway.

I bought my awesome car from the bmw cca website.

I shudder to think of selling a car here. Face to face, thanks.

I've posted cars FS here with no issues, even though they weren't perfect cars. If you are honest about what you have and what you know about it, take some reasonable photos, and fairly represent your item, there won't be a problem.

[Tammer in Philly]

I have bought and sold cars and parts on this site and other Bimmer enthusiast sites. I have never had a complaint as a buyer or as a seller. Represent your wares legitimately and you have no worries. Come in with a bunch of hyperbole, bullshit and lies and face the music.

I once bought a car sight unseen from a trusted forum member here. I opted not to have it inspected. There was no bs in his fs thread because he's not a bullshitter. This site has been invaded by bullshitters wanting to sell junk or cars of questionable history or condition and they get called out. If they don't like it, they can move on to craigslist or somewhere else.

Hear hear. My E34 was purchased the same way. So was my old M5, but through a different forum (and one where people are equally honest). My Saab came through a forum member. My GTI through an e-mail list friend from the pre-forum days. My first E28 was inspected by a member of an even older e-mail list. My X5 was purchased through BF.c with a cursory inspection by a local friend. My (girlfriend's) TT was bought through another email list unseen and un-inspected.

Come to think of it ... I have only purchased one car not through a forum, not out of state, and not sight-unseen. And it was bought from my sister!

Be honest, trust the people with good reputations, verify as needed, and you'll do okay.

-tammer

[waxonwaxoff]

MyE28.com Forum Index -> For Sale / Wanted - Cars

Definition of forum: a place, meeting, or medium where ideas and views on a particular issue can be exchanged.

[tsmall07]

I have bought and sold cars and parts on this site and other Bimmer enthusiast sites. I have never had a complaint as a buyer or as a seller. Represent your wares legitimately and you have no worries. Come in with a bunch of hyperbole, bullshit and lies and face the music.

I once bought a car sight unseen from a trusted forum member here. I opted not to have it inspected. There was no bs in his fs thread because he's not a bullshitter. This site has been invaded by bullshitters wanting to sell junk or cars of questionable history or condition and they get called out. If they don't like it, they can move on to craigslist or somewhere else.

I was going to type a long response, but this pretty much covers it. The only threads that turn bad are when the seller is being an ass hole or hiding something.

[Mike W.]

I think the price of a free ad in and to a special interest group is discussion on it. I've personally questioned some and given a GLWS to others as a free bump for something that sounds interesting. My one and only experience with a car F/S ad was great, the only negative responses were why was I selling.

[adrian in florida]

Well, seems like a landslide for the status quo. So be it! I do like the fact that the polling actually promotes thoughtfull consideration of an idea. Its nice to see a process work and to know that mye28 is for the most part run in a democratic fashion. I think everyone who voted should dip the tip of a finger in ink. If you voted more than once under another name dip another finger.

[unt0uchable]

...I've posted cars FS here with no issues, even though they weren't perfect cars. If you are honest about what you have and what you know about it, take some reasonable photos, and fairly represent your item, there won't be a problem.

Bingo.

[KillerPM]

Bottom line is that if the post is locked, it falls down the list forever. No discussion, no bumping.

That's absolutely not true. The software can be configured to allow bumping after a period of time from the OP only.

Either way, the community has voted and its clear that the community at large do not agree with my idea (and I am ok with that).

What I do see from the conversation is a trend towards an idea of standardizing the way for sale adds are posted.

I think though that the mentality of this community would not accept change of any sort either way.

The community has spoken

[Mark in Toronto]

^^^^Well, 40 or so votes out of how many active users?

I find it difficult to comprehend the aversion to change among members on this forum. Change for some that would be considered progressive.

How many members, some longstanding, walked away from this forum during the political debate that ultimately resulted in TP being created?

Obviously, in this case, self-policing did not work. A form of TP can be found on most, if not all forums on the net. However here, on good old on mye28, it took a crisis that ultimately resulted in change.

It has been said, time and time again, by a number of respected members that they would NEVER consider advertising their cars on this forum.

Maybe that would change if the option to lock a “for sale” thread was provide by the administrators of this forum. This option is provided on many, many forums on the net.

But then, that would require change. Which reminds me, people feared electricity when it was invented, didn't they?

[Tammer in Philly]

^^^^Well, 40 or so votes out of how many active users?

I find it difficult to comprehend the aversion to change among members on this forum. Change for some that would be considered progressive.

How many members, some longstanding, walked away from this forum during the political debate that ultimately resulted in TP being created?

Obviously, in this case, self-policing did not work. A form of TP can be found on most, if not all forums on the net. However here, on good old on mye28, it took a crisis that ultimately resulted in change.

It has been said, time and time again, by a number of respected members that they would NEVER consider advertising their cars on this forum.

Maybe that would change if the option to lock a “for sale” thread was provide by the administrators of this forum. This option is provided on many, many forums on the net.

But then, that would require change. Which reminds me, people feared electricity when it was invented, didn't they? :laugh:

Have you considered that those who claim they would never list a car here are the problem? There are certainly high-dollar, special cars for which most MyE28 forum members are not the target market, but we're all interested in seeing them, knowing what happens to them, etc. Even in an open response environment, there is nothing that stops the owner of such a car posting a link to an external ad and then ignoring the thread. If someone is too sensitive to list it, that's on them. If you're worried about specific individuals who have asked big money for cars that turned out to be polished turds not listing cars for sale, well, I don't know what to tell you.

[stuartinmn]

Bottom line is that if the post is locked, it falls down the list forever. No discussion, no bumping.

That's absolutely not true. The software can be configured to allow bumping after a period of time from the OP only.

This is how the HAMB board does their classifieds. Comments are not allowed and the seller can bump their ad up every so often. They have a huge amount of traffic there and it used to be that the comments would just snarl things up. I think it's a better method.

[tschultz]

Don't lock. We're community based. I bought both my E28s from board members here & the banter / scrutiny / opinions on each thread helped make a better assessment. And you have to admit, sometimes there's a fair amount of entertainment value with some of the BS posts.

I agree. The discussion helps the community as a whole, and also helps down the road for an evaluation of a car (or part) for market value.
There are some harsh comments made, however, I feel like generally they do stem from something not quite right with the vehicle for sale. These comments help identify issues and educate people why or why not the asking price is on target.


Plus no matter what, you will still have the people who come here and make a post without bother to read the "rules" or post format.

[Mark in Toronto]

Bottom line is that if the post is locked, it falls down the list forever. No discussion, no bumping.

That's absolutely not true. The software can be configured to allow bumping after a period of time from the OP only.

This is how the HAMB board does their classifieds. Comments are not allowed and the seller can bump their ad up every so often. They have a huge amount of traffic there and it used to be that the comments would just snarl things up. I think it's a better method.

Good example.

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=7

If you're worried about specific individuals who have asked big money for cars that turned out to be polished turds not listing cars for sale, well, I don't know what to tell you.

No. The community is made of of all kinds of enthusiasts. Some with high end garage queens and others with nice well sorted and maintained drivers.

[cddallara]

I think there's some valid points in the thread.

#1 self policing. I don't mind questions (or constructive criticisms), as I'm not near as knowledgeable about these cars as most.
Compliments are fine too, IMO. Even from people not interested in purchasing the car.
It's the sidetracked personal arguments that get old. Or the non constructive personal opinion comments that offer nothing to either seller or buyer.

#2. Some sort of standard format would be great. Nothing says you can't add additional info at the end if you want to fine tooth comb the ad for your $800 rust bucket...

#3. I vote no locking. Like others have said, put honest pics and description up, be prepared to answer all sorts of questions (and comments), and carry on.

[OR 6er]

I generally scan MyE28 every day. I don't post very often because I generally have less knowledge, or a less strident opinion on the topic at hand. I do however glean pearls that help me in my on again, off again love affair with the euro 6.

I also love the various personalities on display on this forum, I prefer to not have them sensored.

If I understand correctly, MyE28 spun out of Roadfly at some point because their mods/owners didn't appreciate what was on offer from this community. As a result, MyE28 was born to provide a forum with what this collection of characters offers.

Don't like it? Don't visit.

If you joined and your first post is your crappy, bagged out, POS "rare" 528e for $6k and you've never bothered to learn the culture of this board, don't get all butt hurt when you get crapped on.

Please maintain the status quo.


Geoff